"The pattern that the data reveal is extremely odd. It's like finding a zoo of animals of all ages and sizes miraculously having identical, say, weight in their backbones or something. It is possible that a non-gravitational fifth force is ruling the dark matter with an invisible hand, leaving the same fingerprints on all galaxies, irrespective of their ages, shapes and sizes."
"The dark matter seems to 'know' how the visible matter is distributed. They seem to conspire with each other such that the gravity of the visible matter at the characteristic radius of the dark halo is always the same. This is extremely surprising since one would rather expect the balance between visible and dark matter to strongly depend on the individual history of each galaxy."
JCAtom, have you seen Nassim Haramein's presentations?
I'd love your opinion on what he has discovered.
I'll have to read more carefully...but from the .pdf doc you gave, he is saying that a proton is a black hole and that the strong nuclear force is actually gravitation between two (or more?) of them.
One of the parts that I'm having trouble with is that the strong force is what holds quarks and gluons together and that's how a proton is formed...there is leftover force there that holds protons and neutrons together to form the nucleus of an atom. So I'm a little confused on whether he's talking about the "strong force" or the "nuclear force," the nuclear force being that leftover part.
If he's talking about the actual strong force...or strong interaction that gluons & quarks are bound by then there is a problem in equating that with gravity. Gravity obeys the inverse square law in regards to its strength which basically means that as the distance between two objects becomes greater, the gravitational force between them falls off. The strong interaction doesn't do that...it remains constant regardless of the distance between the quarks or gluons bound by it.
He also doesn't mention other particles such as neutrons which are also formed from quarks bound by the strong interaction.
If he's talking about the leftover force that results from this interaction...the nuclear force, then I'm also confused about where all those quarks and gluons go that make up the protons, neutrons, etc. They would be within the proton black hole which would make them, basically lost to the rest of the universe and of no consequence or materiality.
It is clear from these results that the “strong force” may be accounted for by a gravitational attraction between two Schwarzschild protons. In the standard model the strong force is typically given as 38 to 39 orders of magnitude stronger than the gravitational force however, the origin of the energy necessary to produce such a force is not given. Remarkably, a Schwarzschild condition proton as a mass (8.851014 gm) approximately 38 orders of magnitude higher than the standard proton mass (1.671024 gm ), producing a gravitational effect strong enough to confine both the protons and the quarks.
This means that he's talking about the strong interaction.
It's a cool idea...but I'm having trouble with some of the logic.
The noodly appendages of the Flying Spaghetti Monster at work!
I found his presentations easier to grasp than the papers because although I am a scientist, my forte is biological not physical.
If you can find the time to watch - I'd love to hear what you think.
(thinking of space/time as a fractal was helpful for me)
"It's dots all the way down and all the way up." *grin*
Quantum asymmetrical matter seems to have a mechanism link to reconstruct a moving symmetry, super symmetry, common universal force. Almost like reconstructing net- symmetries, quantum symmetries, as links to an infinite symmetrical force.
You'll have to dumb that down for me sometime. It went right over my head.
I'll 2nd that. lol.
Physicists love symmetries. Long ago, they proved that any symmetry in nature will have a corresponding physical conservation law. The fact that space is the same everywhere leads to conservation of linear momentum. The fact that space is the same no matter which direciton you face leads to conservation of angular momentum. So symmetries are big deals.
One glaring asymmetry is bosons and fermions. Bosons obey one set of physical laws (Bose-Einstein Statistics) and fermions another (Fermi-Dirac Statistics). It'd be nice if there was a hidden symmetry between bosons and fermions. Such a symmetry is called 'supersymmetry', because, well, it rocks. It solves a lot of quantum headaches and it'd be really nice if it were real.
One of the predicitons of supersymmetry would be a whole family of very heavy, weakly interacting particles no one has seen yet. These are the supersymmetric partners. Heavy, weakly interacting particles are one hypothetical type of dark matter, the type that best fits the observations from the Bullet nebula and other dark matter lensing observations. Physicists are putting two and two together here and hoping the answer is four. That is, they're hoping dark matter and supersymmetric particles are one and the same, and dark matter is evidence for supersymmetry.
There may be additional physics allowing some sort of interaction between such supersymmetric partners (here, dark matter) and normal matter. If so, it might lead to a dark matter distribution like the one observed. Or it might not. We're way out in theory land, with the particle accelerators and detectors not yet providing data to feed theory.
So all this may be smoke and mirrors. It may actually be a blow to the weakly interacting massive particle (WIMP) theory of dark matter and evidence of some sort of modified gravity. Still, modified gravity falls apart trying to explain dark matter halos and the bullet nebula results, so we can't just dismiss WIMP out of hand.
Either way, this is new, hard, emperical data. Now the theorists have something to grind on, matching their ideas to Reality to see what works and what doesn't. And for something as elusive as dark matter, that is a real treat.
Thanks for the clarification.
lol
Hey, Brent! I was serious!
Eric Albert was speaking Greek... but waffle was speaking English.
... I think...
;-)
It is possible that a non-gravitational fifth force is ruling the dark matter with an invisible hand, leaving the same fingerprints on all galaxies, irrespective of their ages, shapes and sizes."
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A fascinating read, I can only say I do enjoy reading about our universe,I just don't have the word input as you, yall impress me and thank you for sharing your minds and information, I will say, my mind can vision us all being cradled in the palm of a hand, held securely in place.
my mind can vision us all being cradled in the palm of a hand
[wow, Star, I have a synchronicity with that, for real. When I was going through extremely rough times I used to visualize that very image in my mind, I have always found great comfort in it. thank you. nan.]
your very welcome Nan, it is true when you rest your mind to the toils before you, you can capture the sureality of peace. Blessings to your day .smiles
Amazing stuff! This goes to further the idea that we really don't know nearly enough to have any decisive theory about life the Universe and everything! I want to hear from all the atheists and intelligent design people who 'know' everything, please explain this!
Ya I didn't think so.
the answer is 42
I stand corrected, nice one niafabo!
We certainly have a long way to go.
We are the fuzz on the peach, the cheese on the pizza, the cream on the milk, or if I were more of a pessimist, the scum on the pond...
I'd be interested in what precisely they've found.
http://today.slac.stanford.edu/feature/darkmatter.asp
Dark matter has a relationship to regular matter and the both influence the arrangement of the other.
http://curious.astro.cornell.edu/question.php?number=358
I think the arrangement of dark matter has more to do with a true orbit that is not influenced by physical reaction. If you were a piece of dark matter falling towards a black hole you'd most likely miss it and most likely be flung away from it at the speed of light (or possibly faster, who knows what the actual properties of dark matter are). The only thing that could slow you down is the tugs of gravity along the way. You might make it to the edge of the galaxy before you stop and then you wouldn't go back, you'd be more influenced by the matter there. This flung dark matter and the original matter there interact gravitationally.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heliopause#Heliopause
The fast solar wind is about 400 times slower than the speed of light but is still very powerful and fast. Given enough time it stops by running into normal matter. However it does it so far away it's not really influenced directly by the gravity of the sun anymore.
Normal matter flung out at near the speed of light eventually slows down because it eventually bumps into something else.
[clipped] My attention is split too many wayz right now. Clint Eastwood on the TV, hot food on the table, and hot vineage for the eyez.
"It was recently discovered that the mean dark matter surface density within one dark halo scale-length (the radius within which the volume density profile of dark matter remains approximately flat) is constant across a wide range of galaxies ...the luminous matter surface density is also constant within one scale-length of the dark halo. This means that the gravitational acceleration generated by the luminous component in galaxies is always the same at this radius. Although the total luminous-to-dark matter ratio is not constant, within one halo scale-length it is constant. Our finding can be interpreted as a close correlation between the enclosed surface densities of luminous and dark matter in galaxies..."
Universality of galactic surface densities within one dark halo scale-length
High density molecular clouds - which are dark because they contain dust and molecular gas that absorb light - surround areas of hot lower density ionized gases even within galaxies. We reside within one such low density 'bubble' thought to be the result of multiple supernovae explosions and stellar wind around 5 to 10 million years ago. The resulting wall tension between the local bubble and the normal interstellar medium acts as a shield to contain this region and protects the earth and its lifeforms from dangerous flows of cosmic radiation and gas. There is strong evidence that the Local Bubble is in fact, a tube or tunnel that has burst into the galactic halo region and that this tube and others are the source of the million-degree gases seen in galactic halos.
If the surface density of light and dark matter follows LaPlace's Law, which says that the size of the structural radius dictates the size of the wall tension required to withstand the given internal pressure or surface tension which provides for the formation of bubbles in water, and that this tendency to minimize the wall tension in fluids pulls the bubbles into spherical shapes, this might explain the correlation between the enclosed surface densities of luminous and dark matter in galaxies and also account for the form of the galactic structure. It might not even be necessary to modify the law of gravity -
"If we account for our observations with a modified law of gravity, it makes perfect sense to replace the effective action of hypothetical dark matter with a force closely related to the distribution of visible matter."
The existence, nature and interaction of "dark matter" is today's white whale. Like when Bobby Ewing "died"... we wonder if all this is "true" or a screen-writers' trick...
But like "Dallas"... it is great fun!
I like to think that Dark Matter has bit more credibility than Bobby Ewing-Dream Season but you are right it is great fun. It does go to show how little we really know and how much we may never know. Hopefully this one will provide some more wonders and bangs and not get solved with a whimper like so many other scientific mysteries (Bigfoot, Loch Ness etc.) we've had before.
I'm an outsider -- a layman fascinated by all fields of knowledge, science and otherwise. That's a lot of turf, so I try to pick up a few basic anti-BS tools. Occam's razor is among the best.
I wonder what ol' Occam would have thought about "dark matter" and "string theory"......
You're right about it being a lot of country to cover, and Occam's razor is a great policy to follow. Keep it simple but in this case 'simple' just isn't.
I still think (dark matter) is Gravity bleeding through other dimensions.
I would think that seems like a less far-out idea then an exotic substance that seems to be more common the ordinary matter yet almost imposible to directly detect. >.> though I guess both hypothesis would be hard or difficult to test. I hope we figure it out soon. (Preferably within our lifetimes lmao xD)
Interesting post. It may be that the reason behind this unexpected symmetry is understood in the future -- or not. It should not sway anyone from their opinions on the existence of god though, for or against. There have always been mysteries behind the universe. Most of the old mysteries are explained, but it's good to know there are new ones still to be discovered.
Interesting read, thanks.
And the house of cards trying to support the Judeo-Christian 'Big Bang' theory continues to expand. How long before the Astro-physics community finally gives up this nonsense and admits that Hannes Alfvén knows WTF he's talking about??
Seriously? Dark Matter? Why not just admit you have no clue how to make a square peg fit in a round hole.
Electromagnetic force is 1039 TIMES STRONGER than Gravity. Seems like a no-brainer.
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